Timetable 2007 - not so good

[Mr T.]

Just got my hands on a copy of the 2007 timetable for Dublin-Kildare. As a Kildare commuter I'm quite disappointed to see that the 17:30 to Kildare which used to have a scheduled arrival of 18:05 has been replaced with a 17:25 which has a scheduled arrival of 18:09.

Just thinking out loud here, but is this change designed so that more people will actually miss the train as quite a large number of commuters board the 17:30 between 17:25 and 17:30? Is this another clever way of dealing with overcrowding?

Additionally, if we now miss the new 17:25, we'll have to wait 40 mins for the 18:05 - the 18:00 no longer stops in Kildare.

I'm not even going to mention the morning section... it just makes me mad...!

[2Funki4Wheelz]

I know because of the Kildare line project some trains are departing earlier to try to overcome the expected delays (around 7 mins - yeah right! )

[Mark Gleeson]

I did the math on the KRP delays and I got 5 to 8 minutes which matches IE. Also note Adamstown is on the list for all local Kildare services

If you look through the timetable
Cork is hourly at xx:00
Limerick is odd hours at xx:25

We are finally getting a simple clockface timetable which is very important

There is a issue where a train has always left at a certain time being changed but that is life at least now the 17:25 goes to Limerick Mon-Sat on Fridays it used to change completely and go to Tralee

The 18:00 is going to Cork, the 18:05 is the old 18:00

[Mr T.]

Those stats are great - if they're realistic. From experience (and I've been commuting for the last 15 years) 5-8 minute delays (in "railspeak") mean 15-20 minutes delays in reality.

The clockface timetable is a convenient system if the trains actually stopped in your station - the 9pm to Cork no longer stops in Kildare.

I wonder...when the timetable people are changing the timetable, do they actually take heed of the numbers getting on/off at each station. It appears to me that this may not be a factor.

That's life maybe - but it's still not a customer focussed solution to the problem.

[kilman]

I'm looking at the timetable in front of me and there is a very good selection of trains for Newbridge passengers,17:10,17:15,17:25 and 17:50
But like you I'm not happy with the time taken. I know this is the KRP but still.
I've been getting thte 17:15/17:10 to Athlone since it started in 2004.
In 2004/2005 it used to take 46 mins to get to Port
In 2006 it took 49 mins
This year it will take 60 mins.
To be honest this is a pain but if I could get a seat in the evening I wouldn't be half as bothered.(standing for the >100 mins we endured last night is soul destroying) Why don't IE extend the new 17:15 to be an 6/8 car train and remove the 17:10 from having to stop in Newbridge?

[Mark Gleeson]

Send your cheque of 4 million euro to Inchicore Works but then Clondalkin and Cherry Orchard are off the 17:15

There is one extra rush hour train out of Heuston which came about since the slower journeys make it possible.

The real problem is trains making the same station to station journey are not taking the same amount of time.

What we have is a forced timetable where minutes are hacked on to 'make it work' there is then the elegant approach where its designed to work IE haven't grasped that

[kilman]

*scratches his head*.. So why then was money spent increasing the size of platforms and advertising that this was so that they could take longer trains !!

[Mark Gleeson]

Sallins and Hazelhatch where only able to take 4 coaches until extension so intercity and long distance commuter can now stop

[al2637]

Why exactly does the KRP cause reduced times?

Couldn't it be managed better? They built the Port Tunnel under the Northern Line with practically no disruption (under than a few hours one morning )

[Mark Gleeson]

The existing track requires realignment at several points, 25 Mph limit

Station platforms underconstruction in many cases will require speed restrictions, more 25 mph

Short of it taking twice as long to complete the work I can't see any alternative. Irish Rail has had the option in the last 5 years to sort out speed restrictions elsewhere to claw back some of the time but that would only apply to Cork, Tralee and Limerick services

Doing the math worst case you can expect to cruise at 30mph to Hazelhatch, current intercity time is given as 13 minutes (as per internal timetable), its 10 miles so worst it becomes 20 minutes and it effects faster trains more naturally

[2Funki4Wheelz]

Originally Posted by kilman

I'm looking at the timetable in front of me and there is a very good selection of trains for Newbridge passengers,17:10,17:15,17:25 and 17:50

I've always wondered about the 'commuter services' since more and more companies have working hours ending at 5.15 and even 5.30. There's seems to be a bias on the earlier services for commuters - I know places have flexitime etc but most people I know from financial services backgrounds cannot leave until after 5. And it must be worse for shop staff etc.

Newbridge (as an example) will have 4 services in 40 mins, then only 3 in the following 2hrs 15 mins.

The demand arguement might be used, but I'm put off working somewhere away from the Luas red line because of how late I'll get home and would only consider the southside if it was a 5pm finish. There's no demand because people just might work where they can to ensure they get home at an ok hour?

[Oisin88]

Sydney Parade is next to a... Hospital.
(1) major employer
(2) elderly people who can't drive need to go there
=> demand

[Colm Moore]

Originally Posted by Oisin88

(2) elderly people who can't drive need to go there

You can't say that! These people only use the no. 8 bus!!

[Mr T.]

Hi guys - unfortunately we don't have a DART service on the Kildare line at present. But thanks for your input.

[Mark Gleeson]

Believe it or not Irish Rail promised DART to Kildare town back in 2004 but where forced to abandon it by the Dublin Transportation Office

The upside of the new timetable is it will be way more punctual than last year, yes by cheating with slower journeys but still.

As of today the rotten slam door Mk2d coaches are on there last year and Limerick gets a serious upgrade, providing between 8 and 14 seats extra per coach on key services such as the 17:25.

Overall the 2007 timetable is positive, and it does show that if you apply pressure on IE you will get something, Newbridge, Portarlington and Templemore all got something extra.

[Mr T.]

I don't think the punctuality of the new timetable argument will last too long - in fact this morning proved that IE didn't even try to start on a good footing: the 7:16 from Kildare departed at 7:25, arriving in Heuston at 8:10 (10 minutes behind timetable schedule). Also the 7:48 ran 10 minutes late. Good start for the new timetable!

[Mark Gleeson]

IE managers admitted that the 2006 timetable was impossible you couldn't be ontime.

The exact cause of the delay is the real matter, the 5:15 out of Cork made it on time for the first time in ages

[2Funki4Wheelz]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

the 5:15 out of Cork made it on time for the first time in ages

True, although 7mins late to Portarlington, I can't speak for prior stops.
Time will tell, although there did seem to be breathing space in Heuston and there were no crowds on the Luas platform.

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

Overall the 2007 timetable is positive, and it does show that if you apply pressure on IE you will get something, Newbridge, Portarlington and Templemore all got something extra.

Well done to the local user groups and P11. Portarlington went from:
Port to Dub - 14 trains to 18 trains
Dub to Port - 13 (+4 Fri Only) to 16 (+1 Fri Only)

Mostly good news into Dublin yoy, pretty much the same return overall.

And I'm only posting in the NRUG section until PRAG gets it own...c'mon...

[Mark Gleeson]

Slight rejig of the board is coming soon

Big win for us is Kildare local on a Sunday, been pluging it for ages.

[Derek Wheeler]

Originally Posted by 2Funki4Wheelz

And I'm only posting in the NRUG section until PRAG gets it own...c'mon...

You're getting one. Don't worry. It'll be there in all its glory when the decorators have finished. In the mean time funkie, spread the word.