Translink postpones introducing new timetable

[RPI]

Originally Posted by Padna

Passengers travelling from Newry, Dundalk and Drogheda to work in Dublin city centre and looking to be in their workplace by 9am would have had an extra 27, 20 and 18 minutes in bed respectively if the proposed new timetable were implemented.

The main focus of complaints is within the Greater Belfast Area. The 06:15 departure time is felt to be too early, particularly as it would leave before even the first local service reaches Belfast Central. The latter is an issue as many existing Northern Irish passengers will be unable to connect to the service.

There is also a sense in Northern Ireland that Iarnrod Eireann and the NTA sprang the timetable upon Translink without considering the joint nature of the service.

While there is huge support in Northern Ireland for a pre-9am arrival in Dublin, there is a desire that this is delivered through improved journey times. There seems to be a definite awareness that the key stumbling block seems to be Iarnrod Eireann's prioritization of local traffic.

[Inniskeen]

Originally Posted by RPI

The main focus of complaints is within the Greater Belfast Area. The 06:15 departure time is felt to be too early, particularly as it would leave before even the first local service reaches Belfast Central. The latter is an issue as many existing Northern Irish passengers will be unable to connect to the service.

There is also a sense in Northern Ireland that Iarnrod Eireann and the NTA sprang the timetable upon Translink without considering the joint nature of the service.

While there is huge support in Northern Ireland for a pre-9am arrival in Dublin, there is a desire that this is delivered through improved journey times. There seems to be a definite awareness that the key stumbling block seems to be Iarnrod Eireann's prioritization of local traffic.

I think you summarise the situation very well. As far as Irish Rail and the NTA the Enterprise and Dundalk are nuisance. The long term ambition seems to be to convert the northern line into a tram-like DART service and operate it as an appendage to the slow lines between Hazelhatch and Inchicore through the stalled DART interconnector.

It would be interesting to know when NIR were approached about this timetable and whether or not the DRD in Belfast were consulted. Could it be that the partitionist mindset is alive and well in Dublin ?

[Mark Gleeson]

Translink were consulted, they had to provide the paths for the service and agree to the increase on Sunday.

Both IE and NIR management have been asked over and over again to get a train to Dublin before 0845, its a serious business need to do this. Equally the ask for a train to Belfast before 9am has been made numerous times (0610 would work fine...)

NIR its their problem to provide a connecting train

No amount of improvement would get the 0650 to Dublin for 0845, just not possible, non stop, nothing in the way 1 hour 43 is the current benchmark, add in 4 stops, you are over 2 hours

Its very obvious how much slower the train is once in Northern Ireland, its painfully slow, while Dublin Dundalk is always a fairly swift trip, basically an unbroken 90 mph railway north of Malahide bar the stations in Drogheda and Dundalk

[Inniskeen]

Originally Posted by Mark Gleeson

Translink were consulted, they had to provide the paths for the service and agree to the increase on Sunday.

Both IE and NIR management have been asked over and over again to get a train to Dublin before 0845, its a serious business need to do this. Equally the ask for a train to Belfast before 9am has been made numerous times (0610 would work fine...)

NIR its their problem to provide a connecting train

No amount of improvement would get the 0650 to Dublin for 0845, just not possible, non stop, nothing in the way 1 hour 43 is the current benchmark, add in 4 stops, you are over 2 hours

Its very obvious how much slower the train is once in Northern Ireland, its painfully slow, while Dublin Dundalk is always a fairly swift trip, basically an unbroken 90 mph railway north of Malahide bar the stations in Drogheda and Dundalk

So what is the strategy for the Enterprise and longer distance commuters (Donabate to Newry) on the Dublin/Belfast line - the evidence of recent timetables and this proposal is that the users of these services can expect an incrementally degraded service which will culminate in a DART extension to Balbriggan or Drogheda with even slower journey times. There needs to be a published strategy and an honesty about what is intended.

It is clear that the current direction will deliver a service that is increasingly less relevant beyond Malahide and which will carry a fraction of the numbers which could be carried with even modest investment in strategically placed multiple tracking and/or overtaking loops.

No question about an earlier arrival from Belfast, obvious answer is an additional service, maybe 0605 and 0705 from Belfast and yes an 0610 from Dublin.

Not sure what you mean about NIR having a responsibility to provide a connecting service.

Previous Belfast to Dublin schedules had a journey time of an 1hr-45 minutes with one stop. Time to understand why this is now impossible and to address the issues. Maybe 100mph running over significant sections of the route would help and should be achievable at very modest coat - in many instances just changing the 90 mph boards might be all that is required.

[Jamie2k9]

The 201 and EGV are the only two parts allowed to travel at 100mph, coaches are limited d to 90 according to Irish Rail.

Would it be all that crazy for NIR to operate the 06.15 themselves with a 3 coach to see how it goes. Current 06.50 moves to 07.00.

[Inniskeen]

I would be surprised if the running gear on the De-Dietrichs weren't suitable for 100 mph. Yes NIR could and maybe should run an 0615 and hold the set for a 1610 non-stop to Newry. Likewise the 0615 would have to skip Dundalk and Drogheda in order to avoid unacceptable overcrowding.

[Mark Gleeson]

DD's are designed and certified for 100mph and were tested on the Dublin Cork mainline. I've clocked well into the high 90's between Dundalk and Drogheda

The published limit is based on the practice of not showing a speed in excess of the maximum network speed.

[James Shields]

That's a smart idea, but is any of the track currently rated for 100mph?

I would suggest a 6:15 express with minimal stops could arrive in Connolly before 8:15, and an 8:30 express back to Belfast would probably have demand. IE in return could run a 22K express to Belfast in the evening, allowing the De Dietrich to resume normal stopping pattern.

[James Shields]

Going back to the original topic.

Translink have delayed their new timetable.

Have IE responded? Will we have the nightmare scenario where IE forge ahead with their new timetable, but try to keep the Enterprise running to the old timetable without the proper slots being there for it to run on schedule?

James

[berneyarms]

Originally Posted by James Shields

Going back to the original topic.

Translink have delayed their new timetable.

Have IE responded? Will we have the nightmare scenario where IE forge ahead with their new timetable, but try to keep the Enterprise running to the old timetable without the proper slots being there for it to run on schedule?

James

You can be sure that there are ongoing discussions behind the scenes - IE can't implement a new Connolly timetable without getting agreement from Translink.

We will have to wait and see what happens in the New Year.

[Inniskeen]

I gather that it is not just Translink that are unnerved about the negative reaction to the new timetable - questions are being asked elsewhere !